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PEI Adhesion Issue - Ender3 Pro

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  • PEI Adhesion Issue - Ender3 Pro

    Hi all,

    I just recently switched to a new PEI build plate on my Ender 3 and I'm having some difficulty with getting my prints to stick properly. I've checked the bed level, I've cleaned the bed with IPA, but still can't get it right. It usually seems like the prints start OK, but at some point during pretty much every print it pops off and fails. Attached are some pics I took from today's calibration print. You can see the corners are lifting, and when it finished the main print slid off the plate and wasn't stuck at all. Based on some of the failed prints I've come back b to, I think as the prints warp and lift the nozzle then knocks them off (but I haven't managed to catch this in action yet). Hopefully someone here can help narrow down the cause before I lose what's left of my sanity! 😆

  • #2
    Bed surface may be cooler. Try increasing by 5 to 10 degrees and see if that helps.

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    • #3
      I have 2 PEI of the same brand which work so good. But my Prusa PEI is not as decent at all. I read that people rough them up with sand paper.

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      • #4
        I have been having good luck cleaning my build plate with water that has a couple of drops of Dawn in it.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by KitCarlson View Post
          Bed surface may be cooler. Try increasing by 5 to 10 degrees and see if that helps.
          So I tried messing with the bed temp, without success. Prior to the PEI sheet I was running the bed around 65 or so, I tried another test at 70, and the latest at 75, and I'm still seeing the corners lifting, and in turn the print head pushing the print right off. Attached pics of the test run with the 75 degree bed temp (and settings shot as well)

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          • #6
            About 2 months ago I switched from Creality Glass to a Creality PEI - smooth sheet. At first I had issues with bed adhesion, maybe not as bad as you, but was about ready to go back to glass.

            I too read about roughing up the surface and tried it. And yes that helped though I still had some issues with prints not sticking. I used 1500 grit wet and dry and lightly sanded in two directions at 90 deg to each other from edge to edge. Then washed in HOT water only (no dawn soap or the like).

            About that time I upgraded to a Micro Swiss NG Direct Drive All Metal Hot End. The Micro Swiss tech suggested to get PLA prints to stick better
            - 1 Printing the first layer at 215 then drop to 205 for the remainder of the print,
            - 2 Set bed temp to 65 AND
            - 3 Set the first layer line width to 140% width.
            I made those three changes and have not had an issue since. Currently I am very pleased at how the Creality PEI is working for PLA plastic.

            I have played with PETG on the PEI plate and definitely need glue stick to act as a release agent to get the print to not stick. I've recently purchase a Kingroon textured PEI to test with PETG but haven't gotten around to that yet.

            Good Luck

            Larry

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            • #7
              I count all these removable bed sheets as "disposable" items you need to re-buy every now and then.

              That is one reason I bought borosilicate glass beds for all of my printers. I can remove and swap them as I need and I only bought them once. Of course you cannot bend them to release the part, but I have a metal cabinet, which I use as a cooling block. I remove the hot glass sheet from the printer and put it on there. You can hear is popping of within minutes. While it is there, I put a second one one the printer, let it heat up and go for the next print.

              I never printed on anything like glass. Not even painters tape. I got my first printer and used a cheap picture frame glass I had laying around. This worked fine, so I swapped directly to borosilicate glass for safety reasons.

              You can clean glass using the kitchen sink, but I think in total I did this 3 times in 6 years or so. It just works for me. I mostly print PLA, ABS and TPU. For TPU and PETG you need to prepare the bed using glues tick. For ABS rub ABS material onto the bed using acetone, which is required anyway if you want to weld parts together.

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              • #8
                While I mostly agree with Geit, I'm going to diverge on his advice about PETG. I never use glue stick. For 90% of my prints I print on a flexible PEI coated spring steel sheet. As Geit pointed out, it gives me the ability to pop the prints off.
                If I do have some issue with a particular model not sticking to the bed properly I will apply some Dimafix to the bed prior to printing. This is rare.

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                • #9
                  I never use a glue stick, alcohol or acetone, due to allergies. A rag with some detergent between every couple of prints works fine, never touching the plate with greasy fingers is a must, and I use some silly Scotch tape if it's a very difficult small miniature I have to print, where I know it will be knocked off because of it being tall and thin.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ender5r View Post
                    While I mostly agree with Geit, I'm going to diverge on his advice about PETG. I never use glue stick.
                    With a glass print bed you need glue stick or Tape for PETG. If you print PETG on Glass removing the part will destroy the glass bed. In this case it is not to increase bed adhesion, but to decrease it.



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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Geit View Post

                      With a glass print bed you need glue stick or Tape for PETG. If you print PETG on Glass removing the part will destroy the glass bed. In this case it is not to increase bed adhesion, but to decrease it.


                      That is interesting to know!

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Lowteck View Post

                        That is interesting to know!
                        Yeah, it is nasty. Normal PLA also sticks heavily to glass and I ripped of parts when I tried to remove a print from a picture frame glass. With PETG you not only rip of shards of the print bed, but also have this shard attached to the print and wont come off. So a lose - lose situation.

                        For PETG and glass you need a release agent between print and bed.

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                        • #13
                          I print PETG on G10 without a release agent when it cools the part either comes right off or with a little nudge with the scraper

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Geit View Post

                            With a glass print bed you need glue stick or Tape for PETG. If you print PETG on Glass removing the part will destroy the glass bed. In this case it is not to increase bed adhesion, but to decrease it.


                            Completely agree: just one of the reasons I no longer use glass.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Ender5r View Post
                              Completely agree: just one of the reasons I no longer use glass.
                              Well, since I don't touch PETG it is the best stuff for me.

                              I mainly print ABS followed by PLA and TPU.

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